Limbo vs Liminality
These two words have tremendous significance and relevance in the situation we are going through and the state of our societies even before the calamities stepped in .
What are the definitions of these two words?
limbo
noun
US /ˈlɪm.boʊ/
UK /ˈlɪm.bəʊ/
limbo noun (UNCERTAINTY)
an uncertain situation that you cannot control and in which there is no progress or improvement:
Until we have official permission to go ahead with the plans we're in limbo.
Thesaurus: synonyms and related words
· blurred
· blurry
· dodgy
· fuzzy
· sputter
· stutter
· swither
· unclear
now look at the anthropological term. LIMINALITY
liminal
adjective
formal
US /ˈlɪm.ən.əl/
UK /ˈlɪm.ɪ.nəl/
· 'twixt
· amid
· among
· between
· betwixt
· block
· halfway
· in
· inter
· mid
· midst
· partway
EXAMPLES of LIMINAL
liminal
How do the supposed liminal dimensions of some material elements of the ritual relate to fire as a medium of transition?
However, these physical practices also re-choreographed the hidden and liminal spaces to which they were restricted.
Dr JLFS is a Cuban doctor friend of mine, a psychiatrist by training but a person interested in emotional trauma because of his own experiences in Angola and currently in a south American Country. I visit him in his new residence once in a while and we have long conversations and today’s conversation was no different. We talked about Limbo and Liminality.
He pointed out that many of the Cuban migrants to Miami, seem out of place in their own minds when they are here, because there are outside their zones of comfort. We are talking about White Cubans. To somehow make sense of their continued suffering, they begin to blame “them” (whoever it could be either US or Cuba) for their continued suffering. While outwardly they seem to be adjusting well, the inner trauma continues.
I have copied here a bit of our conversation; I have not included my part of the conversation but here are his thoughts in context of our conversation in which we both participate fully.
[17:10, 05/04/2020] No creo q quedarse en esta zona construida, tenga q ver con el sentido del movimiento, creo q tiene q ver con una estructura neurótica de base en el funcionamiento.
Hay un terreno propicio previo que facilita la desarticulación del funcionamiento habitual y determina la construcción mímica, diría q es una alternativa a pesar del sufrimiento, a la desestrucruracion .
Cuando se hacen cambios
:Sobretodo de esta envergadura.
I don't think that staying in this built-up area has to do with the sense of movement, I think it has to do with a basic neurotic structure in operation.
There is a prior propitious terrain that facilitates the disarticulation of normal functioning and determines the mimic construction, I would say that it is an alternative despite suffering, to destruction.
When changes are made
Above all of this magnitude.
Pienso q son muchos factores, uno de ellos tiene que ver con la decisión, dentro de un contexto determinado, expectativas, realidad, manejo de recursos y otros muchos, pero la resiliencia juega un papel fundamental.
I think there are many factors, one of them has to do with the decision, within a given context, expectations, reality, resource management and many others, but resilience plays a fundamental role.
No te olvides , el limbo, también tiene una ilusión de temporalidad, pero depende de otro, además incluye el concepto de creerse justo, lo q implica q mientras no ocurre el rescate el "mundo",está siendo injusto con ellos.
Do not forget , the limbo, also has an illusion of temporality, but it depends on another, it also includes the concept of believing himself fair, which implies that while the rescue does not occur, the "world" is being unfair to them.
Existe en todas partes a con diferentes niveles de movilización y es una cuestión individual. Yo no soy ejemplo, por suerte he tenido una buena y sólida familia, tuve la oportunidad de una buena formación, después tengo una especialidad q me ha ofrecido conocimiento de muchos fenómenos y para rematar estuve en una guerra ajena por dos años, así q en el medio de los muchos defectos y problemas q tengo, siempre pienso, puedo un poco más, aunque a veces muy pocas hay situaciones extraordinarias q me sobrepasan, como la actual.
It exists everywhere with different levels of mobilization and is an individual matter. I am not an example, luckily I have had a good and solid family, I had the opportunity of a good formation, then I have a specialty that has offered me knowledge of many phenomena and to top it off I was in an alien war for two years, so in the middle of the many defects and problems that I have, I always think, I can a little more, although sometimes very few there are extraordinary situations that surpass me.
Todo el q sea consecuente con lo que piensa en general se siente confortable, incluso en las carencias.Es un tanto reduccionista el concepto pero funciona.
All those who are consistent with what they think generally feel comfortable, even in deficiencies. The concept is somewhat reductionist but it works.
Being a traveler around the world, I have observed the limbo nature of “temporary” and permanent migrants and also “refugees” of various types (my heart breaks thinking of the refugees sheltering in camps in many countries around the world, whereas some people claim the status of refugee not because of a war or a deprivation but on ideological grounds).
There is a lateral migration or movement or vertical movement. A person coming from Australia to USA the movement is lateral and the adjustment is minimal, very seldom he or she is in a limbo status. Perhaps the similarity of the economic status and the common language may have something to do with it. I am not sure how an Australian may feel in Germany or Finland or Russia with regard to their language and whether or not that puts him in a limbo category.
Almost all the migration movements and refugee movements are vertical in that they are leaving a less developed country for a more developed country and in some instances very much more developed and also the cultural gap is great. The cultural gap of An Australian moving to UK may be very little but an educated Indian moving to the UK or USA may feel the cultural gap to be much greater despite a common language.
I have also wondered why Iranians moving to Europe, Australia and USA integrate quickly into the society when you compare to people from other Muslim countries or Muslims from other countries.
So preparation before migration, if it is possible, is important in that get yourself a good education, good experiences in life and then migrate for whatever personal reasons you may have. I think it is not fair to expect the host countries to give you the kind of formation and experiences if you had missed them out in your own countries. In Cuba among the young people there is a belief that if only they could go to USA or Europe their life would be much better without realizing that so many impediments lie on their way to that acculturation. A close friend of mine, a 29 year old teacher at a small town in Eastern Cuba said to me; I do not wish to leave Cuba, what am I when I get to a new country where I do not speak the language and do not know many people and have no chance of easy advancement in life and would be forced to do jobs that I don’t have to do in Cuba, here I am a teacher and I can remain so if I wish to.
Immigration is a personal choice and I would never say whether one should leave or not. Here we are talking about Limbo and I feel that in my travels, whether you are South Asian or East Asian or Arab or Muslim or a South American, your entry into the migrant society will not be easy and you can expect to be in that LIMBO… with continued suffering .. as poet Pablo Neruda had written. Un alma sin raices es una injusticia A soul without roots is an injustice. It has no anchor, it floats in the water as per the prevailing winds .. it may never reach the shore .. its initial destination
Let us tackle the word Liminality. It is in the vocabulary of every anthropologist and as students we were thrilled to discover it. I find it an extremely useful concept in Medical practice. Unlike LIMBO which could last a long time and which carries with it misfortune and suffering, Liminality is distinguished by its temporality, more dramatic in nature and the propensity to commit errors during this short transition/jump.
Liminality
Migrants in liminal time and space: an exploration of the experiences of highly skilled Indian bachelors in Amsterdam
Este documento arroja luz sobre la relación entre la agencia individual, las relaciones sociales transnacionales, el lugar geográfico y las construcciones culturales de la fase de la vida y el género entre los inmigrantes indios altamente calificados a los Países Bajos. Amsterdam está atrayendo a un creciente número de inmigrantes indios que trabajan principalmente en los campos de la tecnología de la información, la ingeniería y la gestión empresarial. La naturaleza de este trabajo altamente calificado requiere trabajadores móviles y flexibles y, por lo tanto, atrae principalmente a hombres solteros de entre 25 y 34 años. Sus experiencias y opciones de migrantes están marcadas por un 'desempeño de liminalidad': la migración es parte de un ritual de mayoría de edad estructura sus vidas y está estructurado por circunstancias y agencia. La experiencia de los solteros en particular puede entenderse como una 'doble liminalidad' en el sentido de que es temporal y espacial. Muchos de nuestros informantes solteros sintieron que estaban 'entre y' entre las expectativas socioculturales con las que crecieron y lo que perciben como cultura holandesa u occidental, y entre aquellos que pertenecen a la infancia y la edad adulta. Viven en un umbral metafórico, moldeado por sus ideales masculinos, creencias sobre la 'cultura india', sus trayectorias de vida esperadas y sus experiencias y expectativas en los Países Bajos y la ciudad de Amsterdam.
This paper sheds light on the relationship between individual agency, transnational social relations, geographic place, and cultural constructions of life phase and gender among highly skilled Indian migrants to the Netherlands. Amsterdam is attracting an increasing number of Indian migrants who work primarily in the fields of information technology, engineering and business management. The nature of this highly skilled work requires mobile, flexible workers, and therefore mainly attracts single men between 25 and 34. Their migrant experiences and choices are marked by a ‘performance of liminality’: migration is part of a coming of age ritual that both structures their lives and is structured by circumstances and agency. The experience of bachelors in particular can be understood as a ‘double liminality’ in that it is both temporary and spatial. Many of our bachelor informants felt they were ‘betwixt and between’ the socio-cultural expectations they grew up with and what they perceive to be Dutch or Western culture, and between those that pertain to childhood and to adulthood. They live on a metaphorical threshold, shaped by their masculine ideals, beliefs about ‘Indian culture’, their expected life trajectories, and their experiences in and expectations of the Netherlands and the city of Amsterdam
Here the immigrant Indian is in a liminal period, he is neither here in Amsterdam (life trajectories, expectations of Amsterdam and their experiences) nor in India (beliefs about Indian culture, which is much more personal than a societal one, as “Indian culture” is influenced by geography, race and religion to name a few).
While reading the following description of a Liminal Person, think of an immigrant to France, Germany or England or Australia or USA .. and see how apt a description .. Victor Turner came up with this idea of Liminality building on the concept of Rites de Passage by van Gennep.
Liminality
The attributes of liminality or of liminal personae ("threshold people") are necessarily ambiguous, since this condition and these persons elude or slip through the network of classifications that normally locate states and positions in cultural space. Liminal entities are neither here nor there; they are betwixt and between the positions assigned and arrayed by law, custom, convention, and ceremonial. As such; their ambiguous and indeterminate attributes are expressed by a rich variety of symbols in the many societies that ritualize social and cultural transitions. Thus, liminality is frequently likened to death, to being in the womb, to invisibility, to darkness, to bisexuality, to the wilderness, and to an eclipse of the sun or moon.
Liminal entities, such as neophytes in initiation or puberty rites, may be represented as possessing nothing. They may be disguised as monsters, wear only a strip of clothing, or even go naked, to demonstrate that as liminal beings they have no status, property, insignia, secular clothing indicating rank or role, position in a k1nship system - in short, nothing that may distinguish them from their fellow neophytes or initiands. Their behavior is normally passive or humble; they must obey their instructors implicitly, and accept arbitrary punishment without com- plaint. It is as though they are being reduced or ground down to a uniform condition to. be fashioned anew and endowed with additional powers to enable them to cope with their new station in life. Among themselves, neophytes tend to develop an intense comradeship and egalitarianism. Secular distinctions of rank and status disappear or are homogenized
From Victor Turner, "Liminality and Communitas," in The Ritual Process: Structure and Anti-Structure (Chicago: Al
A Cuban educated doctor may be able to enter a professional lifestyle of an American doctor when he arrives in Miami, but he may forever be in either a LIMBO state or a LIMINAL state. Limbo state involves suffering , nor being at the right cultural space or expectatives not being met, emotional pains accruing and looking for a justification for being there by accusing either Cuba and his perceived enemies there or the lack of acceptance by the Americans by accusing his perceived enemies here. The fault is always outside and not inside.
Liminal immigrant clings on to the culture where he came from while trying to integrate into the new society, being conscious of the fact that he is an outsider. There is less suffering here as he knows that he is not in his cultural space and accepts his incongruity. In his imagination he has somewhere to go back. He has no desire to contribute to the culture of his new homeland, and is often not a good citizen, participating in philanthropy or civic affairs.
Liminal status of the refugee is pitiable. I think of the camps in the Greek island of Lesbos. They have left their homes in Afghanistan or Syria or Bangladesh or Pakistan and looking forwarded to be accepted by one of the EU countries. He might be assigned to Hungary (not welcomed by the Prime Minister Urban) or Finland (an extremely difficult language to master and long winters) or to a place where he is a total alien. (imagine Lithuania?).
While preparing this note, I was reading about the refugee situation in Tripoli, Libya which is beyond heart breaking. In the middle east people are being forced out or leaving Syria by the thousands. Boats carrying hundreds of Rohingya refugees are showing up on Malaysian shores. It is now impossible to make the ocean journey to Australia and many asylum seekers are in Manaus, Papua-New Guinea and Nauru island in the North Pacific. Hundreds if not thousands of Central Americans and South Americans as well as Africans and Chinese and Indians and Pakistanis and Bangladeshis are in Mexico hoping to get into USA.
This situation and the main driving force behind this displacement, Poverty, is troublesome and I am pained to witness it in my travels.
To finish this rambling note, WE CAN SAY THE ENTIRE PLANET IS IN LIMBO as we do not know what is going to happen, the suffering continues.
This note is unedited, written as it came to my mind and heart
